Talk:Superhuman Strength
Question Wouldn't this be better suited as a category? Sigmasonic X 02:02, 26 October 2006 (UTC) :Sorry for the month delay... I didn't realise there was a discussion on this page. I don't know Sigmasonic X. Its a touch and go subject as such as its not one of the open stated powers. Perhaps you are right. One-Winged Hawk 18:41, 21 November 2006 (UTC) Another question Zeff and Don Krieg were said to have super human strength? I've only written those that were mentioned to have it (i.e. Galley-Le company person: "Tilestone get them with your super human strength"). The classification of such like is getting too vague, I'm thinking about cutting out this page or just the list of characters. Most likely the list. A few examples and a explaination is all that is needed. Same with This isn't a technique, this is a body coniditon. One-Winged Hawk 11:15, 2 April 2007 (UTC) Conditions for being listed: What counts: *Named as SS: Miss Monday, Tilestone, Luffy, examples of named characters. *Besting a SS named character in strength: Zoro beat Miss Monday using one hand on her shoulder. *Giants + Fishmen: Not listing every member of their race though. *Demostration of power: Pick up a building and dump it on a person by this I mean... Not break a few bits of wood and have done with it. Not sending a person flying into a wall demostration of power. Hell... Lots of OP characters can do that without trying. Why Mr. 4 got removed, as far as I'm aware he wasn't named as SS. But correct me if I'm wrong with reference to where I missed it please. Why some characters should be shown *Blackbeard punched ace hard enough to cause him to spew up blood and almost broke his neck with one strike :Needs a little more, even in real life, people can do this. As I said, simply puncing people isn't enough - Nami. Thought, I admit I've see her leave more the a lump on someone's head. One-Winged Hawk 15:03, 8 March 2008 (UTC) : Most people don't send someone flying when they punch a guy in the stomach or chop him in the neck like he did with Ace. Also remember, that during his skirmish with Luffy, he grabbed him and slammed him so hard, Luffy actually started to bleed on impact. Since one of the qualifications is besting someone in a hand-to-hand fight with confirmed Superhuman strength, he qualifies. S.C. Amigo 03:24, September 2, 2010 (UTC) *Zeff is strong enough to hurt Luffy (a rubberman and thus virtually immune to blunt attacks) with a blunt kick, he can also shatter large boulders and leave imprints on iron with his kicks :I said it before - Nami... One-Winged Hawk 15:03, 8 March 2008 (UTC) *Whitebeard and Shanks clashing their weapons is enough to split clouds thousands of feet above them in half :Is it a display of strength... Or Willpower? One-Winged Hawk 15:03, 8 March 2008 (UTC) *Garp could pick and throw a metal Ball larger than both his and Luffy's Ship put together! :Good point! One-Winged Hawk 15:03, 8 March 2008 (UTC) *In Asgard form, Moria could split his ship/island in two by punching it :Okay, but we'll have to note that bit. One-Winged Hawk 15:03, 8 March 2008 (UTC) *Don Krieg can lift a large boat in the air with one hand with little effort Who doesn't: *Anyone who just knocked another around: Kuro, Eneru... Heck Nami does this all the time to people should we include her as Super-Strong? *Having Muscles: Why Patty is not here. *Appearing unbeatable: Moria... Eneru... Krieg. Appearing unbeatable doesn't count. Trying to clear things up here before everyone the SHs met gets named. The Yonkou, Will of D. Their getting removed until we know for sure. Same goes for Shichibukai (Moria doesn't show any signs of SS... ). To date I'd only include Mihawk and Kuma but Kuma's is just Devil Fruit power based and Mihawk for obivous reasons. For now, levae them off. One-Winged Hawk 11:38, 13 January 2008 (UTC) :General note: Its already been stated Usopp is as strong as a normal human being and that will never change due unbalancing of the SH power. The SHs are not all SS. I don't want to see any such remark again... And Robin... She isn't SS either, each of her arms has the strength of her arm, which is only as strong as a normal woman's arm. ¬_¬' One-Winged Hawk 22:10, 21 January 2008 (UTC) : Franky ... ::1. Took two large stone pillars and wielded them like nunchucks with no effort ::2. Punched Nero through the ceiling of Puffing Tom. (That's the ceiling of pure steel, al well as walls) ::3. Later breaking the side of Puffing Tom and pushing it all the way to the other side. :::Thank you, thats all I want to see! One-Winged Hawk 18:22, 23 January 2008 (UTC) ::: Can Chopper really be classified as a character with SHS ??! 01:11, 4 September 2008 (UTC) ::::Monster Point at the very least has it. --One-Winged Hawk 08:17, 4 September 2008 (UTC) Blackbeard definitely has it I mean look at how he punched the crap out of ace. Also, Mihawk must have it.He's the world's strongest swordsman, so I say it's a safe bet that his strength is superhuman. Also, Sentoumaru has it although he's a fairly new character. Cabaji Why on earth is Cabaji on the list of people with raw super human strength? Forgive me if I'm wrong, but in all his appearances actually fighting (in the manga, not Anime fillers), he has not once shown super human strength. Subrosian 05:32, 21 May 2009 (UTC) :The reason's apparently he lifted Richie.Mugiwara Franky 05:48, 21 May 2009 (UTC) :I guess I can see that, but he doesn't really display any other feats of super human strength besides that and generally doesn't seem that strong to begin with. Subrosian 07:32, 21 May 2009 (UTC) ::If he lifted up a Sea Cow I'd take it as super strength... We don't know how much Richie weighs... So yeah, he isn't weak but I don't think its quite a sign of super strength. One-Winged Hawk 19:19, November 2, 2009 (UTC) Possible Users *I think Pacifista also posses super human strength, as they are replicas of Bartholomew Kuma, except that they do not posses the Nikyu Nikyu no Mi. However they are cyborgs, much like Franky *And what about giants?, they also posses super Human strength via race.... :Cyborgs are a condition not a race. They've entered the races template I note... But yes, cyborgs should have super human strength, since their metal parts make their muscle strength far above the average human. One-Winged Hawk 19:17, November 2, 2009 (UTC) Too many people This is getting ridiculous. People are getting listed just when they do something that is somewhat strong. They have to be distinctly notable for having Super-Human strength. Cabaji is just ridiculous. Shanks and Roger are speculation. And a lot of other entries are highly overblown. The Pope 04:15, October 31, 2009 (UTC) :It should only be "inhuman" acts of strength. Its a very vague group, it lacks the define characteristics that "super-speed" has. Lifting weights isn't a sign of super strength, lifting a building is. Thats just one example of how far you push this class. One is strong but not strong enough and the other is what we're looking for. This is the same with super speed and Brook, Sanji, Zoro, fast but not fast ENOUGH. One-Winged Hawk 19:16, November 2, 2009 (UTC) ::Tilestone and Miss Monday definately belong here as they both had their strength noted in the story. Zoro, Luffy both noted, Franky no doubts though its down to his cyborg mods. Reguarding races; Giants, Fishmen, definately I'd add the Kuja there too but theirs is trained strength not raw racial strength. One-Winged Hawk 19:23, November 2, 2009 (UTC) Can someone please make Drunk Samurai stop? I've tried talking to him through his talk page but he still isn't giving any reason for reverting all these. The Pope 22:39, November 2, 2009 (UTC) Well reverting definately needs to halt while this is discussed... So yeah. Give me a mo. One-Winged Hawk 23:01, November 2, 2009 (UTC) Just 11 Sanji noted the Just 11 whatitmen are "super strong" and although he downed one easily its worth nodding too. Though, its a case of strong Vs stronger here and Sanji was stronger, the fact he even bothered to mention it though makes it worth noting. One-Winged Hawk 11:13, December 5, 2009 (UTC) Haki Should people with Haki be considered to be superhuman? Marguerite can shoot through several trees with Haki. Breaking through trees is considered to be very powerful. Therefore, should Haki users be posted under "Techniques and Abilities"? Yatanogarasu 15:43, January 6, 2010 (UTC) :Also, Boa Hancock can break stone, most likely to Haki. That's another consideration to categorizing Haki as Superhuman. Yatanogarasu 15:44, January 6, 2010 (UTC) I dunno; while the after-affects of Haki can be sometimes devastating, it's not so much Super-Human strength as it is an explosion of will; "spirit" energy, if you will, not physical. The Pope 03:57, January 11, 2010 (UTC) Don Kreig? I noticed that Kreig, while mentioned in the discussion, isn't on the actual article. I would think he'd qualify. He's been shown to take massive amounts of damage, stop a cannon ball with his bare hand, and lift a ship over his head with one hand. Several times during the Barate arc, it's even mentioned by the other characters that his strengh is enormous. I won't add him myself, because I don't like editing articles, but I will ask for someone else to consider doing it...Gerokeymaster 00:21, February 23, 2010 (UTC) :He was on the page, there was no references known when I removed him. Someone provided the refs, he got readded, now he is gone again. One-Winged Hawk 01:41, February 23, 2010 (UTC) :Don Krieg flinging the fish head of the Baratie with one hand.Mugiwara Franky 06:39, February 23, 2010 (UTC) There's even a link from his page to this one, which also mentions the stopping cannonballs and lifting the boat. It really ought to be added back. If I can get one more concensus on this, I'll just do it...Gerokeymaster 05:02, February 24, 2010 (UTC) :This sort of thing is a by-product of not adding references so folks can double check info quickly to see if it is or isn't worth noting something. One-Winged Hawk 16:22, March 15, 2010 (UTC) Kizaru? why the hell is kizaru here? his devil fruit alows him to kick or punch at the speed at light, its not strength. also he does possess super-human strength just not through a devil fruit as shown when he held own whitebeards bisento with no trouble.19.36, mars 7, 2010 (UTC) Feats of SuperHuman Strength In my opinion a feat of super human strength is ... 1) The Character can lift, push, drag or throw something extremely heavy 2) The Character can break or damage something as though as steel with their bare hands or legs or a weapon that relies on raw strength. 3) Seeing someone overpower a character directly in a feat of strength. Ie. arm wrestle or something like that. Pinning someone from behind or when the character is not aware that he is about to engage in a feat of SHS does not count (ref sengoku-garp. In order to pin someone you don't need to be stronger than that someone) You have to make sure that the character is not using something other than strength. Like haki. Haki does not give the user SHS. Yet it can give its user the power to break stone, as noted. However as far as we know, in a contest of pure strength, Zoro, Franky or Luffy would likely utterly annihilate any of Haki using Kuja pirates (save for Hancock, we don't know full extent of her power). 21:11, April 1, 2010 (UTC) : Small addition, stone breaking might be a DF power (in reference to Boa Hancock). Saibogu no Franky 02:59, June 25, 2010 (UTC) ::Second the haki, ironically today I was considering it myself. One-Winged Hawk 23:13, October 26, 2010 (UTC) Vague The idea of super-human strength as an ability seems vague to me. People's stength is really more of a spectrum, and sure some people are very strong, but I don't think this qualifies an article about it. Otherwise, almost half the characters in One Piece seem to have this ability... I think this should only be considered an ability in the case where it clearly is one. Such as in the case of Miss Doublefinger, where she actually increases her own natural strength. In most cases though, a person's strength is just a person's strength and really requires no article, other than maybe an explanation that in the One Piece world, natural strength can go far beyond what it can in our world. :Its a status not an abilitity (if its not clear, it needs rewriting). Go to Super-human speed to see what I was getting at when I wrote this. It was made because some of the characters got noted to have a "super human" level of strength and I was writing a "Super human speed" note also. It can be altered, since this is a confusing article and has been some debates over this. Essentially, it can be summed up by; "is it above normal human strength, if yes, then it is". Trouble is, in the rewritings over the versions, what orginally the article was intended for may have been lost. :-/ One-Winged Hawk 17:01, April 16, 2010 (UTC) ::I'd like to fix this back to its orginal intent as I feel its getting towards silly. One-Winged Hawk 15:11, April 19, 2010 (UTC) :Yatanogarasu add a lot of people in the super human strength category recently. I revert some back to be more in line with the article. In particular being a zoan devil fruit user or a fishman leads automatically to the category I don't know if it is the real intention. So maybe there is work to do in order to harmanize the article and the category. Kdom 21:40, April 19, 2010 (UTC) :Might be best to retire both super-human pages as suggested, we know by now the requirements. This is getting a bit too silly. One-Winged Hawk 21:42, April 19, 2010 (UTC) :If we really do something wouldn't it be better to simply remove the character's and leave the info? 21:03, April 21, 2010 (UTC) Up is IMO a good suggestion for feats of superhuman strength, which i wrote. I suggest we abide by it. 01:33, April 28, 2010 (UTC) Drake I added Drake because he saved Urouge from a Pacifista with only a couple of kicks. The Pacifista wasn't destroyed but he made a long flight through a wall, I remember. Forgive me if I'm wrong. --Meganoide 15:42, July 6, 2010 (UTC) As noted above, given is not a feat of super human strength. 18:48, July 7, 2010 (UTC) Saibogu no Franky 18:55, July 11, 2010 (UTC) :Sorry, I don't accept opinions by non-registered users at their first contribution. I'll wait for a serious answer. ::There. ... Happy now? Saibogu no Franky 19:13, July 11, 2010 (UTC) Please notice that a Pacifista is heavy, huge and made by steel. And the scene wasn't a gag. I thought that this would have been a proof that he has superhuman strength on his legs. --Meganoide 21:19, July 11, 2010 (UTC) :I can't remember when he did it, but if he did it while transformed it will be covered generally by "zoan" devil fruits as they enhance strength anyhow. Therefore, unless you see something done OUTSIDE of his zoan form, its not an act. Otherwise, brain point Chopper would be here. :Also, if an unregistered IP has a point to make, its rude to force them to sign in just to have their opinion counted, equally one can consider it rude for NOT signing your name. Just noting, its silly, so long as they sign their messages its fine. Though its preferrable if they register first or sign in before messaging, no one on this particular wikia is forcing anyone else. Its too much bother, unlike a site like wikipedia where a person can use 5 computers as anon users to pretend to be 5 people in a voting poll or something... One-Winged Hawk 22:11, July 11, 2010 (UTC) :Meganoide's logic isn't flawed, I think he is referring to the panel were X Drake "saves" Urouge in page 13 of chapter 508, notice that Drake is in his human form when he fights the Pacifista! Notice also that in his introduction he managed to stop Urouge's metallic pillar while the later was fighting with Killer!! MasterDeva 00:29, July 12, 2010 (UTC) :MasterDeva is completely right. I said also (in the article page) that he stopped Urouge's pillar but no one noticed it! No problem, however. Those were the reasons for my addiction of Drake. PS When I talk about Drake fighting a Pacifista, there are few possibilities about the moment in the story i'm talking about... of course i meant at Sabaody, some times before Kizaru made his show. :About the unregistered contributor, I surely wasn't forcing him to sign. Simply, when i work on a new wikia for the first time i don't delete other people's contributions, but i correct some grammatical mistake, or i say my opionion about something, but i don't modify a page only because i don't have the same idea. --Meganoide 07:38, July 12, 2010 (UTC) : :Why have guidelines if people are going to disregard them? One-Winged Hawk wrote an excelent one, and no one seems to care. There are guidelines, some of which i wrote also, and I think they make sense. Otherwise anyone can claim that some ppl are SHS. Besting someone in hand to hand fight is not a feat of SHS (I know this well also from role playing games. A person with high Dexterity can freely block a person who attacks with brute strength with pure weapon finesse. Most systems use this.). X drake could be simply using his sword skills to redirect the attack. Punching someone hard is not a feat of SHS (As noted by One-Winged Hawk above in the guideline). : :Please note in this panel : http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/498/16/ X Drake is using his axe to redirect the attack. Many sword fighting styles are based on simply using opponents strength against them Saibogu no Franky 04:38, July 13, 2010 (UTC) : :And BTW i did feel like i was forced to sign in, as discussion would not go anywhere untill i did so. Saibogu no Franky 04:39, July 13, 2010 (UTC) : :Please do not add X Drake to the list until the discussion is over. Rules exist for everyone. Saibogu no Franky 04:44, July 13, 2010 (UTC) : Well, even Whitebeard is in the list because (i'm reading) he stopped a swing by a vice admiral with one hand on his bisento. It's the same of Drake blocking the pillar with one hand on his axe. Will you remove Newgate too, now? --Meganoide 07:51, July 13, 2010 (UTC) : Ah, but whitebeard is an exception, because the giant was flying from the skies towards him. Thus, he took all of the giants weigth on one arm. Clearly a feat of Super Human Strength. But if that's not enough for you, i recall him stoping a ship with one hand. Even more of a feat of SHS. I just can't recall what chapter is it in, so I'll have to look it up later. I have work to do. Saibogu no Franky 13:10, July 13, 2010 (UTC) : : Here: http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/572/12-13/ Clearly a feat of Super Human Strength. And most impressive one we've seen. Saibogu no Franky 00:47, July 15, 2010 (UTC) Blamenco It is said that he has SHS, but on this page I can't see him. One of the two pages has an error, isn't it? --Meganoide 23:04, July 18, 2010 (UTC) :I think he is eligible for SHS. He wielded a gigantic hammer with ease. Saibogu no Franky 01:23, July 24, 2010 (UTC) : : Enel Enel: Super Human Strength? his physical strength is able to kick "Big golden ball" with size much bigger then his size with little power to bring luffy down from his ship! Juracuille 09.05, July 25, 2010 (UTC) : :Not really. Kicking a ball no matter what size, doesn't necessarily require super-human strength depending on the circumstances. From what I remember, it was just a simple kick and the ball was near the edge so it's not something worth mentioning. :We really need to be somewhat more clearer on stating which character is super-human strong. It's really starting to seem that everytime a character does something remotely strong such as a simple kick, they're immediately considered stronger than a regular person in physical terms.Mugiwara Franky 04:18, July 25, 2010 (UTC) : :I wrote Feats of Super Human Strength section. How about that? I mean its not finished, add what ever you may. Saibogu no Franky 04:58, July 26, 2010 (UTC) : :On topic, Enel is not a character with SHS. No feats. Saibogu no Franky 04:59, July 26, 2010 (UTC) Pell What about Pell? He was able to carry the giant bomb in Arabaste high into the sky. --KishinZoro177 04:22, August 18, 2010 (UTC) :Could be just wing power. Doesn't necessarily qualify for SHS SSJ 5 04:50, August 19, 2010 (UTC) Miss Monday, Mr. 2 and Others *Miss Monday uses Kairiki Meriken (Superhuman Flour-grinder) against Zoro! *Mr. 2 can fight on par with Sanji (another confirmed human with Super-Human Strength) using his feet! Kurei also states that one of his kicks is as strong as a shot from a rifle!! *Most Cyborgs we've seen if not all have metallic parts that exceed the strength of ordinary muscle, for example Franky and the Pacifista (Kuma included)! The animals in Karakuri island were also modified for labour work by Vegapunk!! MasterDeva 14:21, August 31, 2010 (UTC) :*Excess!ve! Punctuat!on! Makes!!! Arguments! Lo!ok Val!d!! :*Then you should have put that in the reference as I asked you to many times. :*It doesn't matter if he claims it or that he can fight on par with Sanji. You need to have a reference that demonstrates that either his kicks were as strong as Sanji's or that he performed a feat of super-human strength. :*It's still a very broad generalization.Bastian9 17:45, August 31, 2010 (UTC) ::Please use your brain and think rationally for a moment! MasterDeva 17:48, August 31, 2010 (UTC) :So in other words you don't have anything to refute my arguments so you're just trying to insult me. Bastian9 17:56, August 31, 2010 (UTC) ::I have clearly stated my arguments with proofs both from the manga and anime but you're stuck on the use of the exclamation mark. You haven't even made a valid counter argument yourself, if anything I should be complaining. If you think that the references should be updated then do so instead of only reverting the article, you're a bloody editor! The only reference that I did not add was from chapter 596 were Franky is talking about the cyborg animals. MasterDeva 18:05, August 31, 2010 (UTC) :Um, if you're not going to actually attempt a counter argument beyond sounding incredibly pompous and ignorant, could you kindly shut up. If you wish to argue, actually try to refute my arguments.Bastian9 19:38, August 31, 2010 (UTC) Now it's you who is insulting me, so I politely tell you stop or else. Could you please do update the references instead of repeating the same thing over and over and over again? You're a wikia editor the sources are there damn it review the chapters and make the necessary changes that must be done, geez! MasterDeva 20:10, August 31, 2010 (UTC) :Hmm... insults *looks up* That comment is extremely ironic. Also I have no need to update the references myself. The confirm tag is for exactly this purpose, so unless you want it to stay you or someone else needs to update the references. Bastian9 20:56, August 31, 2010 (UTC) You must be a deletionist on Wikipedia. Since that's the typical lazy attitude that they all have. SeaTerror 07:31, September 1, 2010 (UTC) :Umm, the characters in question have references next to them. With that evident, isn't it a bit silly to request a citation when a citation is right there. If more reference is needed then it indeed should be looked up. However putting up a citation request for more references when one is already there is just silly. Citation requests as I understand are used foremost when there is not a single reference to back up a statement.Mugiwara Franky 09:00, September 1, 2010 (UTC) Delete Along with , should we delete this page? It is unofficially named, and Oda himself never confirmed the term's validity, just like Super-Human Endurance. These "Superhuman" pages are just too much of a hassle to keep, they are unofficial, they are open to speculations and vandalism, and therefore have no real grounds in this Wikia. Should we start to discuss, or just start a countdown to see if there's any objections before deleting, or just delete it right now? Yatanogarasu 04:14, January 31, 2011 (UTC) :Don't jump the gun Yatanogarasu, "Super-Human Strength" has been mentioned by characters in One Piece many times. It is also one of the most easily identifiable of the two and by actually been referred to in the series, it is not groundless to say the least! MasterDeva 04:21, January 31, 2011 (UTC) ::Then can someone please put in the kanji and romanization? I tried once, and Klobis says there's "no Japanese word" for it (well, that excuse was for the same thing for the super speed, but I'm sure he did it for the same reason). Yatanogarasu 05:11, January 31, 2011 (UTC) I think only the Super-Human Strength and Super-Human Speed articles should be kept out of those type. They are quite interesting articles. SeaTerror 19:42, January 31, 2011 (UTC) Fishmen? Should fishmen really be considered SHS users? I know they have inhuman strength, but fishmen are fishmen, not humans are they? I mean, saying that fishmen are SHS users is basically like saying Bananawanis are also SHS users to me. I mean, fishmen are a different species than humans after all. Also, as for the giants... I don't know if they qualify as a human or not, so I'll wait for someone's reply on that fact.　JapaneseOPfan 00:15, February 16, 2011 (UTC) Fishmen as well as giants etc. don't have superHUMANstrength, because, well they're not human. We should take it out. Panda 14:58, May 4, 2011 (UTC) Don't take it so literally. While the above are not humans, the average human can still be a reference for other races. Oda himself used the simple rule for fishman (average fishman = 2 times stronger than an average human) because it is easy to comprehend by the reader. You can compare them that way because they are both not human, but humanoid. 'Bananawanis are not humanoid, and thus can't be compared to humans, fishman, giants etc. (Tbh, I'm all for deleting this page completely, but if we do not, we should do it properly and include other humanoid beings). Just 2 cents. 15:13, May 4, 2011 (UTC) That's like saying a lion has superhousecat strength. It's true but it doesn't add any information about the strength of the lion because housecats and lions are entirely different animals. Same goes for humans and giants. Oh, and oda only said that fishmen have 10x the strength of ''average human beings, so that brings us to the question where would "superhuman strength" start? A bodybuilder might have 10x the strength of an average human like myself, but that obviously doesn't make him superhuman. --Panda 15:23, May 4, 2011 (UTC) I agree. Giants are already expected to be incredibly strong due to their size. This category should be reserved for humans. As for fishmen, their higher strength is already explained on their species page, so them being strong would be a given and not require the category. 15:26, May 4, 2011 (UTC) @Panda Well, by your logic the whole page doesn't add any information about the strength of anyone, because the average human strength isn't really defined in One Piece as well. All this page does is causing irritations. One category is just not enough to cover all different levels of "superhuman strength". I mean seriously, Miss Monday is in the same category as Luffy and Garp. The article is such a misleading mess that it doesn't hurt to include races that are born with "superhuman strength" as well, thats what I'm basically saying. 15:54, May 4, 2011 (UTC) Many Characters I usually saw in many characters' page that there is a link to SHS, text as "incredible, inhuman strength" or something like it, but when I look here I can't see their names on the list. Maybe we just write the qualities of SHS and the races and techniques that grant it. 20:07, April 8, 2011 (UTC) There was a discussion about Buchi who had SHS even before being hypnotized. But so why hypnosis is considered a tecnique to obtain SHS? --Meganoide 14:35, May 26, 2011 (UTC) :I think "Some Humans" pretty much covers most of the characters on the list, the rest are covered in other ways. One-Winged Hawk 14:38, May 26, 2011 (UTC) Humans only I think we should get rid of any character in this category that isn't human. That way, it is easier to make a basis for a comparison and it reduces the numbers. Giants aren't humans and neither are fishmen, their strength should be compared on their own scale. Is giant A more powerful by a large extent than giant B? We shouldn't compare apples to oranges, we should compare humans to humans. If humans are the basis for strength, then Superhuman Strength is going to be the most overloaded category on the site. Giants and fishmen will always be stronger by human standards. Their may be a fishman that is comparably more powerful than other fishmen, but that is on a different scale. Superhuman Strength should be left to the humans, since it is in the title. It is not Supergiant Strength or Superfishman Strength, it's Super''human'' Strength. 23:32, June 9, 2011 (UTC) Totally agree. I mean, the superhuman thing is that a human actually reaches their strength. 23:45, June 9, 2011 (UTC) Oh really, where was that defined? Superhuman strong could be just a flowery phrase after all, not necessarily a category for humans. Why can't we just get rid of this page and create one that simply lists ways to obtain great levels of physical power? Like *hard training, *Rokushiki techniques, *Devil Fruit abilities, *certain races etc. I think it would make an interesting article, at least it wouldn't be as misleading (come on, figures like Garp and Luffy share the same category as Miss Monday). The current system suggests that the listed characters are at the same or similar level of strength, which they are undoubtedly not. 23:56, June 9, 2011 (UTC) Same level of strength? Hell no.. They just have abnormal strength compared to other humans. They are not in the same category. 00:00, June 10, 2011 (UTC) Of course they are not. But the page suggests exactly that. Try to view the article with the eyes of someone who isn't as informed as you are. 00:05, June 10, 2011 (UTC) So, you say like, split the 'Individual Characters'..? Sounds good okay. But I think the page pretty clear this up. And how are we gonna categorize Miss Monday's or Mr.4's superhuman strength.? 00:13, June 10, 2011 (UTC) What's the problem with Monday's and 4's strength? Aside from Skypieans and Birkans, races shouldn't be included. I mostly just want to get rid of all the parts that talk about how fishmen and giants have it. Anything about a race that could never be mistaken for human should not have superhuman strength involved. 00:17, June 10, 2011 (UTC) @LPK No, we can't split them on our own because that would be playing Oda. What I suggest is getting rid of the current system of '''listing individual characters. Instead, we create a page and list ways how to obtain great strength in One Piece (compared to regular human standards). 00:28, June 10, 2011 (UTC) @DP Nothing is wrong with Mrs Mondays strength, it is just on a level that isn't comparable to other characters on that list. It is simply misleading, someone that isn't as informed as us would think the listed characters all play in the same league. Anyway, i see superhuman strength as a phrase, not as a comparison between humans. And Arlong approves of that, as he calls Jinbe "Ah superhuman bastard" after Jinbe brutally punched him. (CHapter 624 page17) 00:28, June 10, 2011 (UTC) I'm not concerned about listing the ways that strength is obtained so much as the other races that don't compare to humans. 00:34, June 10, 2011 (UTC) But people in One Piece compare races to humans, apparently. Else why would Arlong call Jinbe a superhuman bastard? 00:37, June 10, 2011 (UTC) That was one time and we don't know the exact translation, so it could have meant something else. Also, since the only cross species matchup has been between humans and another race, it's hard to say if humans are the only compared race. A fishman fighting a giant might use a different term. 00:45, June 10, 2011 (UTC) Well, sure the translation might be off, but it is better than nothing, or speculating what term other races would use. Nope, I'm not convinced. If people want to keep a list like that (which I'm against anyway) then it should include Fishmen and Giants. I see superhuman strength as a phrase, and unless someone tells me that the example with Jinbe is just badly translated, I have at least one evidence on my side that it is truly used as phrase and should not taken literally. 00:57, June 10, 2011 (UTC) But we cant just use that as a phrase cause Arlong mentioned one time in the manga, which can be bad translated. And it cant be a phrase as some of them are actually much stronger. Fishmen are born this way and so does giants. Humans with 'super strength' should be the ones that reach to their level of strength and only humans. I agree that giants and fishmen deserves a different term. 11:33, June 10, 2011 (UTC) As I said, maybe it is badly translated, but by that logic every info we have could be. Unless Jopfan (or another subbing grub) says otherwise we just have to take it. "It might be, it can be, they probably use a different term" - this is just pure speculation. 11:42, June 10, 2011 (UTC) I wanted to go the other way round,eliminate all humans(come on,every char in OP's a SHS...I'm sure Robin can beat me,so she's a SHS(example))..so yeah we can keep only the Gaints and the Fishmen. Lol. We are not comparing ourselves with One Piece characters. And for me, humans are the main race that can have superhuman strength. In other races everybody in them has that, and in humans there are some of them. 11:51, June 10, 2011 (UTC) So you don't compare them to real life standards? Then, may I ask you what do you compare them too? What is the level of a regular One Piece human? Where was regular human strength ever defined? 11:54, June 10, 2011 (UTC) Let's compare a superhuman and a non superhuman : Luffy and Usopp Luffy as a superhuman, can brake walls with his punches and also punch cannon balls that explode nearby. Usopp on the other hand, cant do that. He cant destroy a wall with his physical strength or brake the floor with his foot. I mean only some humans has that. It makes perfect sense. I compare between them. Human to human. 12:02, June 10, 2011 (UTC) Is Usopp stronger than a real life human? 12:16, June 10, 2011 (UTC) :It was confirmed Ussop's on the lowest level end in terms of strength, Oda writes him to be as close to a normal person can be in terms of strength so the common person has someone to relate to on the crew no matter what. Usopp's skills lie in sharp shooting, not raw strength, he has incredible stamina though. This also applies to Nami and Robion (though Robin has ways around her physical strength restriction). Chopper is also normally quite weak, its only because of his transformations he get any strength at all. One-Winged Hawk 12:22, June 10, 2011 (UTC) We are talking about One Piece life. Not reality, we compare the fictional characters. And no he isn't. 12:18, June 10, 2011 (UTC) Might I voice an opinion on races. The basis for superhuman is anyone stronger then normal. Not everyone on top is superhuman, is Usopp and nami? No. Tashigi is not Superhuman. Brook has displayed none. Anyone stronger then normal is superhuman, simple as that. However Arlong called Jinbei a super human? Well if the averge fishman is stronger then the average human, there WILL be the same sitaution amongst the fishmen as humans, some are simply above the normal strength fishmen have. I don't know, it might be worth noting only users who display above average for their race and renaming the topic "Super strength" or something in that case. One-Winged Hawk 12:28, June 10, 2011 (UTC) What do you think about removing the "individual character style" as a whole and just create a page like you suggested, "Super strength"? We could name the various ways how one can obtain it (training, Rokushiki, devil fruit, hypnosis, steroids etc). It could be an interesting article and it would definitely save us the trouble we have with this page currently - like the constant edit ping pongs going on because someone believes Ivankov is super human strong because he can lift his big head.. 12:36, June 10, 2011 (UTC) This would also solve the problem of races - since we don't list anything in particular anymore, just general ways to obtain/achieve great strength. 12:38, June 10, 2011 (UTC) What chapter did Arlong call Jinbe a superhuman bastard? 14:53, June 10, 2011 (UTC) Here in the last panel. But it doesn't play any role to all the superhuman thing. 14:58, June 10, 2011 (UTC) Of course it does. 15:02, June 10, 2011 (UTC) I asked Jopfan for a translation. Hold off on discussing it until she responds, otherwise we'll just be going around in circles. 15:14, June 10, 2011 (UTC) Ok, Jopfan said that what Arlong said could translate to monster strength or superhuman. There is still one thing about it that is bothering me and that is context. Arlong hates humans, so why would he refer to the strength of a fishman as superhuman when biologically humans are weaker? Especially one who took him out with one hit like that. If someone punched me hard enough to almost break my jaw, the last thing I would call them is physically inferior. Also, why would Arlong speak even remotely nicely about humans like that? I really think it might have been a translation thing. There's one last thing I've been thinking about. If Arlong had said "monster strength" and not superhuman", would we even be having this argument? 17:20, June 10, 2011 (UTC) I don't think that a comment made by Arlong, and can possibly mean 'monstrous strength' like DP said, and it makes perfect sense, should change the definition of superhuman strength. I say let's split up the 'Individual Characters' to the categories that Jinbe suggested or better ones, if we can find some.. 17:32, June 10, 2011 (UTC) Alright, I had an interesting talk with Jopfan. Apparently, Kairiki has no exact translation. What does this mean? "Superhuman-strength" is not a named ability, but an adjective to describe strength (not necessarily superhuman). This was the very reason why the page still exists in the first place (there was an attempt to get rid of it months ago), because people said its officially named and thus deserves to stay. Superhuman-speed is already deleted, and I'm gonna open a forum this weekend to do to the same with this one. Really interesting how topics evolve. 17:47, June 10, 2011 (UTC) Well the biggest problem of "Superhuman Strength" is the category itself and the list of s.h.s. users. So if you'll made the forum include the option keep the page, but remove the category and the list of users. I don't mind keeping the page itself, even if it isn't a named ability (it's still a concept). Yeah, I don't mind what would come after, I suggested myself to simply name ways to obtain great strength. However, this is definitely the nail in the coffin for our current system of listing individual users, since there is no way to tell what is really meant by Kairiki (superhuman strong or just strong?) 18:08, June 10, 2011 (UTC) : I once created a forum(about this) which was not replied to..so I removed a lot of names from the category in a misson to empty it,but since I never had a bot at that time I couldnt ..I now wait for a decision here. This page is up for being deleted so this is a waste of space, either do something now or just forget it, your talking about what to do with it and not doing a thing only causes me more grief then this page and its cousin caused me. ¬_¬' One-Winged Hawk 21:04, June 14, 2011 (UTC) Category:Deleted Article Talk Pages